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Technical Guitar Review

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tkaiser replied at Sun Oct 11, 2015 09:18
I compiled the Actions Semi kernel on my own and modified drivers/cpufreq/*-cpufreq.c to be able t ...

For 1.3GHz, the temperature is really high, it will trigger the temperature control and make the CPU down.
And maybe the heatsink or a fan maybe the best way to clock up to 1.3GHz.

tkaiser  
Edited by tkaiser at Sun Oct 11, 2015 23:14
tony_zhang replied at Sun Oct 11, 2015 19:24
Because there are 2 different USB3.0 cable pin definition in the marketing, so maybe you will but  ...

So why don't you ship release notes with the stuff you finish and send out?

Where's the problem to write a few sentences when you ship hardware for reviews? Just a simple "Regarding USB 3.0: It's not ready now, please don't try to test, we will add informations later"?

In other words: None of the reviewers out there did even try to use USB 3.0... And this is the only feature that makes the S500 interesting for a lot of use cases.

And why on earth did you choose the Micro-B connector instead of the normal "Type A female" when you're aware that USB3 isn't useable this way?

tkaiser  
tony_zhang replied at Sun Oct 11, 2015 19:47
For 1.3GHz, the temperature is really high, it will trigger the temperature control and make the CPU down

No, I was able to clock the Guitar over an hour at this upper limit (adjusted the thermal trigger from 105°C to 110°C) and it ran the whole time stable above 100°C: http://forum.armbian.com/index.p ... kers-guitar/?p=2030

So if you follow the obvious best pratices (operating the board vertically so that convection can jump in, apply heatsinks -- the usual stuff enclosure designers will ignore) no throttling will occur. But since I didn't found any informations regarding operating temperatures inside PMU's or SoC's manuals: Where is the information how such temperatures affect the achievable lifespan of the device?!

Do you have made tests? Does Actions Semi has?

tkaiser replied at Sun Oct 11, 2015 23:01
So why don't you ship release notes with the stuff you finish and send out?

Where's the problem to ...

We have evaluted the USB micro B and the normal USB. If we use normal USB, it can not be automatical switch between host and device mode. We need manual to set it to host or device forcely.And if we use the USB micro B, it can automatically detect the device and host mode. But we need a right OTG cable.

As we planned, we will also release another base board that has a USB3.0 hub IC so that we can have normal USB 3.0 and micro B USB3.0. Also the base board will have USB3.0 to 1000Mbps ethernet IC.

I will tell Peter to post a right USB3.0 definition on the forum soon.


Comments

Please don't write anything in a Wiki that has not even a "Recent Changes" special page. Such a Wiki is totally worthless especially considered the quality of documentation right now  Post time Oct 13, 2015 14:07
better in the wiki to the baseboard itself.  Post time Oct 13, 2015 00:57

tkaiser replied at Sun Oct 11, 2015 23:05
No, I was able to clock the Guitar over an hour at this upper limit (adjusted the thermal trigger f ...

The maxium temperature is limited at 125 degree. We and Actions have did many test about the temperature.
If we run at 1.3GHz, and just run the normal software not the benchmarks, the system can work normaly. If we run the benchmarks at 1.3GHz, the temperature may go up over 125 degree, some cpu core will closed to make the temperature down.
And we also have tested many kind of heat sink and fan to make the temperature stay at 50 degree.
We will release all the notes we take in this month. This month is the beginning. More and more information and documents will be wirtten and publish.
And also we will help to construt the xapple community to make some universal information on S500.

Comments

And please use the wiki not the forum. It is hard to find such information in the FORUM - wiki wiki wiki  Post time Oct 13, 2015 01:04
if you put this to the wiki: which heat sink fit the best - this would be great  Post time Oct 13, 2015 00:59

tkaiser  
Ok, to sum it up:

Since the Guitar has eMMC and therefore the theoretical need to flash it (using USB OTG and the ADFU mode) you chose a connector type that's incompatible with normal peripherals? Since I have only Macs running OS X or ESXi around (Windows and x86 Linux only running inside virtual machines) I cannot even use ADFU! But i would love to use normal USB 3 peripherals. Without useable USB 3 the Guitar is way too slow for my use cases. Compared to a Banana Pi/Pro with GBit Ethernet and native SATA the Guitar is many times slower when used as a NAS with USB2 storage and only Wi-Fi or Fast Ethernet.

And I still don't get it why you ship a product for review without proper release notes mentioning such problems. It's a real mess!

Regarding 1.3 GHz: You say it's ok to adjust the maximum frequency to 1.3 GHz unless you run performance hungry software? That's a joke. Every multithreaded task that amoks can bring the SoC above 100°C even with the default 1.1 GHz (which I consider a sane default. I wouldn't operate the device with 1.3 GHz unless I would setup a Monitoring solution that is able to shutdown tasks or lower the clock speeds manually in case of longer load periods since as I repeatedly reported thermal throttling sometimes fails to work!)

I added a summary to the top of my review thread and am finished now: http://forum.armbian.com/index.p ... kers-guitar/?p=1941

tkaiser replied at Tue Oct 13, 2015 14:17
Ok, to sum it up:

Since the Guitar has eMMC and therefore the theoretical need to flash it (using U ...

I met with Actions yesterday, and reflect the problem from reviewers and developers like you.
1. The SoC temperature should improve again. I have send your test and summary to them.
2. We have patched the Ethernet drivers, the speed has been improved again to about 8MB/s. We will release it in next version.
3. We may could find a solution about how to burn the system into emmc from SD card.
4. We hope some early reviewers can reflect more and more inssues for us, that we can test, reproduce and know what you are care,  so that we know how we can improve and satisfy users requirment.

BR

tony_zhang replied at Mon Oct 12, 2015 19:39
The maxium temperature is limited at 125 degree. We and Actions have did many test about the tempe ...

@ Tido
Of course. we will do

I have updated the Guitar GPIO wiki page to the latest base board rev.b

tkaiser  
tony_zhang replied at Tue Oct 13, 2015 21:34
I have updated the Guitar GPIO wiki page to the latest base board rev.b

A wiki without a 'recent changes' link is totally useless! Or do you want us to check every few hours individually every Wiki page for changes?

It's just a simple MediaWiki setting to show the link to this 'special page' http://wiki.lemaker.org/Special:RecentChanges in the left sidebar. Why don't you enable that?

Regarding improvements:

  • When do we get support for at least kernel 3.10.78 LTS? "All users of the 3.10 kernel series must upgrade."
  • What about failing thermal throttling?
  • Why don't you exchange the positions of battery connector and the mounting hole nearby so that at least 3 mounting holes share the positions with the RPi where the positions originate from?
  • Where are the USB3 specs you and Peter are always talking about?
  • ... (I stop here, it's too annoying)

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