Other projects

LCD 7" and LM Guitar case BananaHome

17 2279
cyryllo  
Today make new case for Guitar and module LCD 7"
http://www.thingiverse.com/thing:1058921

cyryllo  

Amazing work as always, man! Can't wait to have a 3D printer to test them!

cyryllo  
Vexelius replied at Sat Oct 10, 2015 15:12
Amazing work as always, man! Can't wait to have a 3D printer to test them!

Thx
Also remake case for Banana PRO

tkaiser  
cyryllo replied at Thu Oct 8, 2015 07:21
And second case http://www.thingiverse.com/thing:1059695 ;)

BTW: You should be aware that unlike other ARM SoCs, the Guitar's main components are really 'hot stuff' and some mechanisms that should prevent overheating randomly fail to jump in.

I managed to get the SoC's temperature above 110°C even with factory settings clock speeds and a simple benchmark running for half an hour. And thermal throttling didn't work then for unknown reasons to me: http://forum.armbian.com/index.p ... kers-guitar/?p=2044

In my eyes it's important to keep that in mind when designing enclosures for this board. Both SoC and PMU can be used as water boilers since their temperatures might easily exceed 100°C

When testing an enclosure I would recommend to monitor core temperatures and cpufreq settings by using
  1. while true ; do echo "SoC: $(awk '{printf ("%0.0f",$1/1000); }' </sys/devices/virtual/thermal/thermal_zone1/temp)°C, PMU: $(awk '{printf ("%0.1f",$1/1000); }' </sys/devices/b0170000.i2c/i2c-0/0-0065/atc2603c-hwmon.0/ic_temperature)°C, clock $(awk '{printf ("%0.0f",$1/1000); }' </sys/devices/system/cpu/cpu0/cpufreq/scaling_cur_freq) MHz" ; sleep 1; done
Copy the Code
While torturing the board using either
  1. while true ; do sysbench --test=cpu --cpu-max-prime=20000 run --num-threads=4 ; done
Copy the Code
or
  1. cd / && stress -c 4 -m 2 -i 2 -d 2
Copy the Code



tkaiser  
Scary results. This is Lemuntu's default kernel and Lemuntu's default cpufreq settings (rather conservative with the CPU's upper clock limit at 1.1 GHz) and the emulation of an enclosure not providing any airflow around SoC and PMU while running both 'stress' and 'sysbench' in a loop (maximum CPU load -- remember that when you put also significant load on the GPU then temperatures might easily increase a lot more):

  1. SoC: 113°C, PMU: 94.6°C, clock 1104 MHz
  2. SoC: 112°C, PMU: 95.0°C, clock 1104 MHz
  3. SoC: 112°C, PMU: 94.6°C, clock 1104 MHz
  4. SoC: 113°C, PMU: 94.6°C, clock 1104 MHz
  5. SoC: 113°C, PMU: 94.8°C, clock 1104 MHz
  6. SoC: 113°C, PMU: 94.8°C, clock 1104 MHz
  7. SoC: 112°C, PMU: 95.0°C, clock 1104 MHz
  8. SoC: 112°C, PMU: 94.8°C, clock 1104 MHz
  9. SoC: 112°C, PMU: 94.8°C, clock 1104 MHz
  10. SoC: 112°C, PMU: 95.0°C, clock 1104 MHz
  11. SoC: 113°C, PMU: 95.0°C, clock 1104 MHz
  12. SoC: 112°C, PMU: 95.0°C, clock 1104 MHz
  13. SoC: 114°C, PMU: 95.0°C, clock 1104 MHz
  14. SoC: 114°C, PMU: 94.8°C, clock 1104 MHz
  15. SoC: 113°C, PMU: 95.2°C, clock 1104 MHz
  16. SoC: 113°C, PMU: 95.2°C, clock 1104 MHz
  17. SoC: 114°C, PMU: 95.2°C, clock 1104 MHz
  18. SoC: 112°C, PMU: 95.4°C, clock 1104 MHz
  19. SoC: 112°C, PMU: 95.2°C, clock 1104 MHz
  20. SoC: 112°C, PMU: 95.4°C, clock 1104 MHz
  21. SoC: 113°C, PMU: 95.4°C, clock 1104 MHz
  22. SoC: 112°C, PMU: 95.4°C, clock 1104 MHz
  23. SoC: 113°C, PMU: 95.2°C, clock 1104 MHz
  24. SoC: 113°C, PMU: 95.4°C, clock 1104 MHz
  25. SoC: 114°C, PMU: 95.0°C, clock 1104 MHz
  26. SoC: 113°C, PMU: 95.2°C, clock 1104 MHz
  27. SoC: 113°C, PMU: 95.6°C, clock 1104 MHz
  28. SoC: 113°C, PMU: 95.4°C, clock 1104 MHz
  29. SoC: 112°C, PMU: 95.4°C, clock 1104 MHz
  30. SoC: 112°C, PMU: 95.2°C, clock 1104 MHz
  31. SoC: 114°C, PMU: 95.0°C, clock 1104 MHz
Copy the Code


Unfortunately no thermal throttling happens. This is an area where LeMaker has to investigate. And what has to be considered when designing enclosures. Unlike nearly all other ARM SoCs Actions Semi's S500 is freaking hot!

The very same board still running stress and sysbench but with enough airflow and standing upright looks now like this a few minutes later:

  1. SoC: 97°C, PMU: 82.4°C, clock 1104 MHz
  2. SoC: 98°C, PMU: 82.0°C, clock 1104 MHz
  3. SoC: 99°C, PMU: 82.2°C, clock 1104 MHz
  4. SoC: 99°C, PMU: 82.4°C, clock 1104 MHz
  5. SoC: 98°C, PMU: 82.2°C, clock 1104 MHz
  6. SoC: 97°C, PMU: 82.2°C, clock 1104 MHz
  7. SoC: 97°C, PMU: 82.4°C, clock 1104 MHz
  8. SoC: 97°C, PMU: 81.8°C, clock 1104 MHz
  9. SoC: 98°C, PMU: 81.8°C, clock 1104 MHz
  10. SoC: 98°C, PMU: 82.2°C, clock 1104 MHz
  11. SoC: 99°C, PMU: 82.2°C, clock 1104 MHz
  12. SoC: 97°C, PMU: 82.2°C, clock 1104 MHz
  13. SoC: 98°C, PMU: 82.2°C, clock 1104 MHz
  14. SoC: 98°C, PMU: 82.2°C, clock 1104 MHz
  15. SoC: 98°C, PMU: 81.8°C, clock 1104 MHz
  16. SoC: 98°C, PMU: 82.2°C, clock 1104 MHz
  17. SoC: 97°C, PMU: 82.0°C, clock 1104 MHz
  18. SoC: 98°C, PMU: 81.6°C, clock 1104 MHz
  19. SoC: 98°C, PMU: 82.0°C, clock 1104 MHz
  20. SoC: 97°C, PMU: 82.0°C, clock 1104 MHz
  21. SoC: 97°C, PMU: 82.0°C, clock 1104 MHz
  22. SoC: 97°C, PMU: 81.8°C, clock 1104 MHz
  23. SoC: 97°C, PMU: 81.8°C, clock 1104 MHz
  24. SoC: 98°C, PMU: 82.0°C, clock 1104 MHz
Copy the Code


Airflow and optionally the use of a fan should be the most important design criteria when building enclosures around Actions Semi's little stoves...

tkaiser  
To test 'worst case' conditions appropriately one has to set the system under full load for at least 5 minutes, better are 10-15 minutes. I adjusted my monitoring setup and tested again starting with an idle system (60°C SoC, 52.5°C PMU) using again both stress and sysbench. It took more than 12 minutes until the maximum (94°C SoC, 76.3°C PMU) was reached. Lower values than before since I managed to get even more airflow (stack-effect):

  1. 10:14:46: SoC: 60°C, PMU: 52.4°C, clock 408 MHz
  2. 10:14:56: SoC: 68°C, PMU: 55.5°C, clock 1104 MHz
  3. 10:15:06: SoC: 72°C, PMU: 58.4°C, clock 1104 MHz
  4. 10:15:17: SoC: 73°C, PMU: 60.3°C, clock 1104 MHz
  5. 10:15:28: SoC: 75°C, PMU: 62.3°C, clock 1104 MHz
  6. 10:15:39: SoC: 78°C, PMU: 63.3°C, clock 1104 MHz
  7. 10:15:49: SoC: 78°C, PMU: 64.4°C, clock 1104 MHz
  8. 10:15:59: SoC: 80°C, PMU: 65.6°C, clock 1104 MHz
  9. 10:16:09: SoC: 81°C, PMU: 66.6°C, clock 1104 MHz
  10. 10:16:20: SoC: 82°C, PMU: 67.0°C, clock 1104 MHz
  11. 10:16:30: SoC: 82°C, PMU: 67.4°C, clock 1104 MHz
  12. 10:16:41: SoC: 84°C, PMU: 68.7°C, clock 1104 MHz
  13. 10:16:53: SoC: 85°C, PMU: 68.7°C, clock 1104 MHz
  14. 10:17:03: SoC: 84°C, PMU: 69.3°C, clock 1104 MHz
  15. 10:17:13: SoC: 85°C, PMU: 69.7°C, clock 1104 MHz
  16. 10:17:23: SoC: 86°C, PMU: 70.1°C, clock 1104 MHz
  17. 10:17:33: SoC: 86°C, PMU: 70.7°C, clock 1104 MHz
  18. 10:17:44: SoC: 87°C, PMU: 71.1°C, clock 1104 MHz
  19. 10:17:55: SoC: 87°C, PMU: 71.1°C, clock 1104 MHz
  20. 10:18:05: SoC: 88°C, PMU: 71.7°C, clock 1104 MHz
  21. 10:18:17: SoC: 87°C, PMU: 71.8°C, clock 1104 MHz
  22. 10:18:29: SoC: 88°C, PMU: 72.0°C, clock 1104 MHz
  23. 10:18:41: SoC: 88°C, PMU: 72.4°C, clock 1104 MHz
  24. 10:18:52: SoC: 88°C, PMU: 72.4°C, clock 1104 MHz
  25. 10:19:02: SoC: 89°C, PMU: 73.0°C, clock 1104 MHz
  26. 10:19:12: SoC: 88°C, PMU: 72.8°C, clock 1104 MHz
  27. 10:19:22: SoC: 89°C, PMU: 73.0°C, clock 1104 MHz
  28. 10:19:33: SoC: 90°C, PMU: 73.4°C, clock 1104 MHz
  29. 10:19:43: SoC: 89°C, PMU: 73.6°C, clock 1104 MHz
  30. 10:19:54: SoC: 90°C, PMU: 74.0°C, clock 1104 MHz
  31. 10:20:07: SoC: 90°C, PMU: 74.0°C, clock 1104 MHz
  32. 10:20:17: SoC: 89°C, PMU: 73.8°C, clock 1104 MHz
  33. 10:20:27: SoC: 90°C, PMU: 73.8°C, clock 1104 MHz
  34. 10:20:38: SoC: 90°C, PMU: 74.2°C, clock 1104 MHz
  35. 10:20:48: SoC: 90°C, PMU: 74.2°C, clock 1104 MHz
  36. 10:20:59: SoC: 90°C, PMU: 74.2°C, clock 1104 MHz
  37. 10:21:11: SoC: 91°C, PMU: 74.6°C, clock 1104 MHz
  38. 10:21:22: SoC: 90°C, PMU: 74.6°C, clock 1104 MHz
  39. 10:21:33: SoC: 90°C, PMU: 74.8°C, clock 1104 MHz
  40. 10:21:44: SoC: 91°C, PMU: 74.6°C, clock 1104 MHz
  41. 10:21:54: SoC: 92°C, PMU: 75.0°C, clock 1104 MHz
  42. 10:22:04: SoC: 91°C, PMU: 75.2°C, clock 1104 MHz
  43. 10:22:14: SoC: 91°C, PMU: 74.8°C, clock 1104 MHz
  44. 10:22:25: SoC: 92°C, PMU: 75.2°C, clock 1104 MHz
  45. 10:22:35: SoC: 92°C, PMU: 75.0°C, clock 1104 MHz
  46. 10:22:45: SoC: 92°C, PMU: 75.2°C, clock 1104 MHz
  47. 10:22:55: SoC: 92°C, PMU: 75.4°C, clock 1104 MHz
  48. 10:23:06: SoC: 91°C, PMU: 75.4°C, clock 1104 MHz
  49. 10:23:17: SoC: 92°C, PMU: 75.4°C, clock 1104 MHz
  50. 10:23:28: SoC: 92°C, PMU: 75.5°C, clock 1104 MHz
  51. 10:23:39: SoC: 92°C, PMU: 75.5°C, clock 1104 MHz
  52. 10:23:49: SoC: 91°C, PMU: 75.5°C, clock 1104 MHz
  53. 10:23:59: SoC: 92°C, PMU: 75.9°C, clock 1104 MHz
  54. 10:24:10: SoC: 92°C, PMU: 75.7°C, clock 1104 MHz
  55. 10:24:20: SoC: 92°C, PMU: 75.9°C, clock 1104 MHz
  56. 10:24:31: SoC: 92°C, PMU: 75.9°C, clock 1104 MHz
  57. 10:24:43: SoC: 91°C, PMU: 75.7°C, clock 1104 MHz
  58. 10:24:53: SoC: 92°C, PMU: 75.7°C, clock 1104 MHz
  59. 10:25:03: SoC: 92°C, PMU: 75.5°C, clock 1104 MHz
  60. 10:25:13: SoC: 91°C, PMU: 75.9°C, clock 1104 MHz
  61. 10:25:23: SoC: 92°C, PMU: 75.9°C, clock 1104 MHz
  62. 10:25:34: SoC: 92°C, PMU: 76.1°C, clock 1104 MHz
  63. 10:25:45: SoC: 92°C, PMU: 75.9°C, clock 1104 MHz
  64. 10:25:55: SoC: 92°C, PMU: 76.1°C, clock 1104 MHz
  65. 10:26:05: SoC: 91°C, PMU: 76.3°C, clock 1104 MHz
  66. 10:26:15: SoC: 92°C, PMU: 75.9°C, clock 1104 MHz
  67. 10:26:25: SoC: 92°C, PMU: 76.3°C, clock 1104 MHz
  68. 10:26:36: SoC: 94°C, PMU: 76.3°C, clock 1104 MHz
  69. 10:26:46: SoC: 92°C, PMU: 76.3°C, clock 1104 MHz
  70. 10:26:57: SoC: 92°C, PMU: 76.3°C, clock 1104 MHz
  71. 10:27:07: SoC: 93°C, PMU: 76.3°C, clock 1104 MHz
  72. 10:27:18: SoC: 93°C, PMU: 76.3°C, clock 1104 MHz
  73. 10:27:28: SoC: 92°C, PMU: 76.1°C, clock 1104 MHz
  74. 10:27:38: SoC: 92°C, PMU: 76.3°C, clock 1104 MHz
Copy the Code

HHHooooo, such temperature is DANGEROUS for the CPU.
I'm not sure the board can survive for long time without heatsink ... potentially voiding the installation of any hat on this board

(It's a quite common situation on 4core ARM unfortunately).

tkaiser  
destroyedlolo replied at Mon Oct 12, 2015 07:35
HHHooooo, such temperature is DANGEROUS for the CPU.
I'm not sure the board can survive for long tim ...

I don't know whether that's dangerous or not. Such temperatures might be quite normal. Let's look what's in S500's manual... surprise: Nothing. We might ask LeMaker but they won't answer as usual.
And no, that's not quite normal for quad core ARM SoCs. When I do tests I always monitor things like temperatures and clock speeds since if you don't do this you get results you wouldn't expect when throttling jumps in:

These are the temperatues the 4 thread sysbench run produced on 4 quad core SoCs:
  • LeMaker Guitar 1.3 GHz: 75.5°C (heatsink applied)LeMaker Guitar 1.1 GHz: 79°C (no heatsink back then)Raspberry Pi 2 1.0 GHz: 56°C (no heatsink)ODROID-C1+ 1.7 GHz: 62.5°C (standard heatsink applied)Wandboard Quad 1.0 GHz: 42°C (standard heatsink applied)
The problem is that the S500 reaches its maximum temp after minimum 10 minutes full load. So using benchmarks that do not run long enough you don't get the real picture whether a device can be clocked at its advertised top speed longer than just a few minutes without dropping performance due to throttling (and unfortunately this is the case with Guitar @ 1.3A -- without a fan performance gets either worse than with 1.1 GHz or when throttling decides to fail you might burn your SoC)

At the moment I would forget about the marketing phrase 'up to 1.3 GHz' since it might only work with load peaks but will get worse if you need full CPU load over longer periods of time. Unless LeMaker or Actions Semi provide a proof that the S500 withstands weeks under full load with 1.3 GHz I won't use this setting. But since using 1.1 GHz seems also too hot if the device is under heavy load longer than 10 minutes... I don't know what to say regarding the S500. I don't like the idea that a device is advertised as being pretty fast since it's able to be clocked at 1.x GHz and I myself have then take care to lower cpufreq settings since otherwise I would've to use a fan to cool it down if software starts to amok for whatever reasons.











You have to log in before you can reply Login | Sign Up

Points Rules